Has anyone dealt with the robotic parking garages?

The 2021 IFC/IBC Section 903.2.10.2:
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Mechanical-access enclosed parking garages. An approved automatic sprinkler system shall be provided throughout buildings used for the storage of motor vehicles in a mechanical-access enclosed parking garage. The portion of the building that contains the mechanical-access enclosed parking garage shall be protected with a specially engineered automatic sprinkler system.

Some of the articles I read indicated a water mist with foam. Completely new thought processes to go through for these since there is very little access for fire personnel.

Any thoughts on where to begin or what to read would be appreciated. Thanks.

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There was a warehouse that was struck by a tornado in 2021 which is in my jurisdiction, and we are now seeing some warehouses wanting to place pre-built tornado shelters within their buildings (which is great).

My question is: do the pre-built shelters need to have sprinkler protection?

My feelings are that the shelters are non-combustible, the only fuel-load would be from the 5-gallon bucket-style water closet and a privacy drape.

Obviously, a fire in this unit while occupied would not be tenable long before a sprinkler head would activate. I also understand that if a portion of a building that would normally be sprinklered (a school hallway) and is "hardened" to make it qualify as a shelter would still require sprinklers.

Thanks in advance for any help or guidance.

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I’ve been reviewing standards to determine the equivalency between fireproofing thickness and the fire resistance rating.

This is for an industrial plant structure. I realize there are many factors but at some point I need a reference to determine what the rating is required to be.

What is the process to determine what the required fire-resistance-rating of a component needs to be?

In this case, it is for structural steel supporting columns of the open structure. The structure is composed of the main support columns and those supporting vessels, etc. The structure is about 5-6 levels tall.  For simplicity I wanted to address the main columns starting on floor 1 where a pool fire may start.  If I could find the standard / guidance for this then I can adapt for vessel supports, etc.  

I’ve been through calculations and information from API 2218 to determine the fireproofing thickness for a certain hour rating. However, I have yet to determine or find the hourly rating requirement.

I’m assuming it will be 1-3 hours, for example, using API 2510 (LPG) as a guide with reference to UL 1709. It does specify a 1½ hour time rating which then gives a fireproofing thickness. Further, the fire protection requirements will come from a risk assessment of the system. I have to be able to give guidance to the risk team to help them come to suitable answers.

What can I use to provide a best answer to an hourly rating, hopefully, chapter and verse?

Thank you for your help in advance.

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I have a highrise that exceeds 400-ft in height. The engineer designed a combination riser with all of the floor control assemblies coming from one riser, and not alternating as is in code. 

I'm wondering if there's something I'm missing - any way around alternating the floor control assemblies, like upper-level pumps being considered separate systems or something of the like?

​Looking for better understanding here and being sure I'm not missing something bigger picture. Thanks in advance.

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​In the corridors of an apartment building (wrap) there are fire doors that are double-egress pairs that are left-hand-reverse by left-hand reverse which follows the natural traffic pattern within the corridor.

However, there are also several right-hand-reverse by right-hand-reverse in the same corridor.

Is there a requirement one way or another on which direction these are supposed to be?

​I informed the project manager that the egress needs to follow the natural traffic pattern. I was curious about the different flow patterns of the doors so I researched the code but was unable to locate anything in the code regarding whether it was code or not, except for the AHJ. The county where I live also agreed with me but if someone out there knows if this is code please respond.

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We are working on a whole suite of fire protection systems designed for a new power plant. We'll be submitting the systems for owner and consultant's approval.

Are power utilities governed by the same jurisdiction (building code) as other properties?

If not, how are they regulated in regards to determining the building code (ie: who dictates the applicable codes)?

Thanks in advance.

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We have a stand alone open-air pool pavilion with no attached building.

There is a gas grill under the roof with a very elaborate hood/exhaust/Ansul system. There is no fire alarm system in this pool pavilion.

The Fire Inspector wants the Ansul system monitored by the clubhouse fire alarm system that is 100-ft away.

Is he correct by code?

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[Moderator's note: since the first lithium battery question a few weeks ago, we've been flooded with more questions on the topic. We'll do our best to not overburden everyone here but still keep with the topics people are asking. As always, we're thankful for you all!]

Could anybody point out some publications that deal specifically with the ventilation of lithium-ion batteries during off-gassing and how the ventilation should be controlled?

I am familiar with FM Global Loss Prevention Datasheet, and NFPA 855, and I went through some publications such as FIA, however from those I only get that there should be sufficient ventilation.

I am more interested in the off-gas detection part of the design.

The ventilation should be turned on and ESS turned off at the first sign of explosive gasses, but what gasses should those be?

H2, CO, C2H4, CH4, or all mentioned in a combination?

Not sure how to proceed in this.

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I am an architect working on a project where we're construction an air-supported structure (dome) for a school district to use as their physical education gymnasium.

The fire marshal here wants the dome fire suppressed.

I told him we cannot hang water piping from the dome.

What are the options to provide fire suppression inside of a air supported structure that is 180 x 135 feet?

Are there alternatives, like water cannons along the perimeter? If so, what kind of costs might that suggest?

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I am a recent architectural graduate designing and developing a small apartment building with a robust dedicated bike storage room (in lieu of car parking). The goal is to foster sustainable, walkable, urban design.

My concern is the recent and growing occurrence of e-bike electrical fires often triggered by non-UL certified lithium batteries. As I understand it, electrical fires are a different animal than your traditional wood fuel fire, in so far as effective suppression, burn rate, etc.

Does current code satisfy any electrical fire concerns?

Does NFPA 13 or even 13R provide sufficient protection for tenants and occupants in this new e-bike era?

Is this a topic of discussion among the ICC and code communities?

Concerned and looking out for safety. Thanks in advance.

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We have received a request from an owner of a small office/warehouse (Group S-1) which is approximately 2,000 sqft to omit sprinkler drops into the office buildout portion.

The office buildout portions is about 500 sqft of the total space.

There are existing sprinklers located at the ceiling level throughout the space and 1-hour partitions dividing the space from other owners.

The background: This individual office/warehouse is in an inline building that is separated into multiple office/warehouse spaces, all individually owned as "office condos". The overall building (approximately 14,000 sqft) was provided with a sprinkler system throughout as it was unknown how the building was going to be divided in the future for the individual spaces. The ownership closing documents and the "condo" association that controls the building have no comments or requirements for the individual owners regarding the installation of dropped sprinkler heads into built-out areas.

Since the individual office/warehouse space is per code (2015 IFC) too small to require a sprinkler system and the existing sprinkler overhead system is already in place providing protection for the space, is it OK for the owner to omit the drops into the small office area if not required by code?

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Is there a code requirement - IBC, IFC, or somewhere else - for a Knox Box?

I understand some jurisdictions amend code to require a specific key box - and I'm sure a specific "Knox Box" brand isn't written into code - but just a requirement that triggers the fire department key box to begin with.

I've always asked the jurisdictions whether they wanted one, and they usually do, but I've never found a requirement that I probably should know about by now.

Also, I've had this missed on many a job in a scope gap between subcontractors and the general contractor. What division would supply and install these? 

As a consultant I usually get a bunch of pointed fingers elsewhere anytime I ask who is planning on providing it.

Thanks in advance, appreciate the variety of perspectives here.

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Is there a situation, other than a fire pump room, where a sprinkler riser room would be required to have direct access to the exterior?

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What are the required system components for a Fire Alarm System versus a Fire Sprinkler Monitoring System?

I've ran into a debate on this in multiple jurisdictions. I know a fire alarm system has occupant notification and initiating devices, such as the smoke detectors, pull stations, waterflow, etc., whereas sprinkler monitoring is just waterflow notification.

But, is occupant notification required for a Sprinkler Monitoring System?

Furthermore, do horn/strobes need to have a secondary power supply, like Fire Alarm System components do?

Is a smoke detector required above the panel/radio/dialer? 

I know it depends on the local AHJ, but I'm looking for some guidance here... I am the local AHJ.

Thanks for your input!

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Are there any code requirements, or restrictions, to using spray-applied cementitious fireproofing on a steel structure in the space above the ceiling of a building when it is being used as a return air plenum?

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Is there a minimum ceiling height that would be required for a Fire Pump Room?

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I have a parking structure that is sitting in the middle of an apartment complex. The bottom two floors are "podium" design and the architect is saying those floors are "enclosed" - thus requiring dry sprinklers throughout those floors.

Above the podium the garage floors are considered "open" and therefore I believe do not require sprinklers.

Has anyone run into a similar situation?

Perhaps with a parking structure that has underground portions and above ground portions?

In those cases, what is the code logic for sprinklers in one area versus throughout?

Thanks for any assistance!

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We have a proposed fire hydrant in our county that will have pressures ranging from 210 psi to 250 psi according to the engineer designing the underground line.

My Chief and I are looking into this in regards to NFPA standards/applicable code, and are concerned that the high pressure could injure firefighters or damage equipment.

Is there a maximum permitted pressure that a hydrant can be, per code?

Thanks in advance.

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A question came to me about the survivability requirements for an elevator landing communication system required by 2018 IBC 1009.8/NFPA 101 7.2.12.1. 2016 is the applicable NFPA 72 edition.

The designer is arguing that since NFPA 72 Section 24.3.13 doesn't call out "elevator landing communication systems" by name that it falls under Section 24.3.13.12 and requires a risk analysis. They did note that the 2019 edition "clears up some confusion" but don't mention that the 2019 edition modifies section 24.3.7.2 to reference "elevator landing communication systems" and refer their design to the area of refuge/rescue assistance section 24.10 along with stair communication systems.

The 2016 edition of 24.3.7.2 just references "elevator emergency communication systems, section 24.11" which is pretty clearly about the in-car call systems, not the systems required at the landings by IBC/101.

Now I've done my homework, its pretty clear that from 2016-2019 NFPA wants elevator landing communication systems to meet the same requirements as an area of refuge communication system, and from 2019-2022 its explicitly clear that the elevator landing communication systems need to be robust; further more the commentary language of the IBC, NFPA 101 and NFPA 72 for the elevator landing and area of refuge communication systems all pretty much say the same thing that non-self-evacuating occupants needs a reliable means of communication for the duration they remain in the building, so the two systems would need to function the same.

My problem is that for the 2016 edition this is all implied and implicit language.

I am very confident that elevator landing systems require the same survivability as area of refuge systems but can't find an explicit code reference to support it. Is there a section/commentary section/something I'm missing?

Thanks in advance.

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Is there an applicable code reference for minimum distance between a fire hydrant and a transformer?

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Hoping to gain some insight from industry here:

Working on preliminary layouts for a large industrial facility that is comprised of tilt-up precast single-story building (~40' tall) and flanked on one side by an equipment yard (think generators, switchgears, mechanical equipment) configured in two levels (think mezzanine).

Question is on fire access to the main building: The mechanical yard runs the entire length of the main building and we are considering fire access as the depth of the equipment yard is ~100ft with a limited service corridor separating the two (~12ft) for maintenance and building egress. There will be periodic gaps (~6ft wide) between equipment located at grade, however the access will require passing through the yard on foot (underneath the second level of equipment on the mezzanine) to gain access to the main building.

Per IFC 503.1.1 our fire access roads must provide continuous access to the exterior within 150ft of the building.

Would passing "through" the mechanical yard at grade meet this requirement?

Would placing "driveways" through the yard to allow a truck to pull closer to the building (but being parked underneath the second level) be kosher?

A similar question exists regarding having hydrants located directly under the second level near the extents of the yard, is this OK?

Have been unsuccessful at locating any code references regarding fire access through a "tunnel" if you would. An AHJ perspective would be much appreciated, along with any other thoughts/feedback.

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Is there an established method to "prove" that we have enough fire flow for a project site?

I understand that the premise is to be sure we have the correct water supply available at the site. We do. I'm just interested in the technical 'design' portion to validate that concept.

​Typically, I run a hydrant flow test at the site with nearby available hydrants. In this case, we're adding new hydrants but I understand the water supply nearby with recent testing.

Is a hydraulic graph (N^1.85) showing the available water supply at 20 psi sufficient to "prove" fire flow, or should I be conducting some type of calculation where I'm "flowing" hydrants?

We do sprinkler calculations all the time, but I'm just curious if I'm either overcomplicating things or if there's a process for fire flow that I'm not yet doing which I should be. 

Trying to get things right. Thanks in advance.

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Can anyone point me in the right direction for codes pertaining to the construction of a draft curtain?

My client will be installing them as part of an attic design, where draft curtains are required per the sprinkler listing.

The sprinkler data sheet covers the depth requirement of the draft curtain. From browsing some websites I can gather they can be constructed of fire-resistant fiberglass woven textiles, glass (smoke baffles), or even panels of sheet metal.

Does NFPA or the IBC define how they are to be constructed?

My client will most likely use sheet metal. I'm curious if there is a gauge requirement for the metal. I may be overthinking it, but I like to see the code defining the curtain requirement, to avoid the contractor putting the wrong materials in place. I appreciate any help that anyone can provide. Thank you.

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What are you all seeing or specifying for firestop identification labels?

Masterspec calls for metal or plastic labels.

I found an FCIA (Firestop Contractors International Association) article that speaks to stamped metal tags or ceramic fiber tags (Google is failing on what that actually would look like).

It seems the firestop manufacturers all have stickers.

I have always specified the metal or plastic labels using the Masterspec language. If I get anything at all installed, it is the manufacturer stickers. I have concerns about the longevity of the stickers.

I’m curious what others are calling for, what your AHJs or clients ask for, and what is actually getting installed. Thanks in advance.

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How is it determined whether a steel structure will have spray-applied fire resistant materials?

I'm creating performance specification for a bid-set on a project, so I don't yet have input from a structural engineer. The project is a warehouse with large fire loads and exposed steel.

Recently, a project out for bid is a low-rise office building, 100% sprinklered with a wet-pipe system that is concealed by a suspended ceiling. On that project, all of the structural steel has spray-applied fire resistant materials.

What drives the issue of spray-applied fire resistive materials?

Thanks in advance.

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