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I have a project for a Cast and Forging plant, which requires a "double interlock sprinkler system per NFPA 13". That's the first I've heard of a "double interlock sprinkler system".
My question is do I have to use a deluge valve or would this be an alarm check valve? Would nozzles be open or closed? Many questions, thanks. Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe
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A project I'm on has a lobby area with a 35-foot tall ceiling next to the elevator door.
NFPA 72-2010/2013 Section 17.7.3.1.3 and 17.7.3.1.4 allows a smoke detector within 60-inches of the top of each elevator door to protect the opening. This can be used for elevator recall. In addition to this smoke detector, do I also need one at the ceiling (35-feet) for normal coverage? Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe To me, it makes more sense to locate a backflow on the suction side of a pump. However, I have recently run across a facility with the backflow downstream of the pump (discharge side).
The main fire pump controller is connected between the the first check valve and the backflow preventer. The jockey pump is connected after the backflow preventer. Here's the problem: when the first check valve fails, the main fire pump continuously starts & stops because the pressure is bleeding off they the relief valve while the jockey pump remains idle. Is this an acceptable scenario? Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe Distilled alcohol storage on single/double row racks. I feel like I am loosing my mind in a big way.
I currently have a larger liquor store that I am trying to design that will have a stock room which will utilize 10-ft tall single and double row racks. These racks can contain alcoholic beverages that exceed 20% (Everclear). What standard/section does this fall under? So far I've only found sections that exclude this kind of commodity. I am sure I'm missing something stupid simple on this one. Thanks ahead for the help. Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe I am reviewing a building under construction for a client, specifically the wet sprinkler system installation.
There was a problem where the installer left caps off the pipe both on pipe being stored and pipe installed at the ceiling. My client stated concerns about debris falling into the pipe due to other trades doing work in the area and requested that the sprinkler installer perform corrective measures, they proposed using compressed air to blow out the pipe. The client wants them to provide some type of justification, industry standard or NFPA guidance that says this is an acceptable means. I looked in NFPA 13 and NFPA 25 and only found how to deal with in-service systems that have obstructions. Has anyone dealt with a similar situation or know what the industry standards are for cleaning out pipe during the construction phase? Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe I was hoping to get some feedback on whether interior Special Application Window Sprinklers would require a separate zone from the remainder of the floor fire sprinkler system?
I do not see any provisions that would require separate zoning per NFPA 13 nor the IBC. However, I can see why it would be important to zone these areas separately seeing as the intent of the window sprinklers is to maintain the integrity of the fire rated separation (as opposed to actively suppressing the fire). Thanks in advance! Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe We have a floor control valve and 2-inch drain pipe on a multi-story building.
Where should I drain this? If I drain directly to a floor drain in a toilet room, I'm not confident that the floor drain can accept the flow. Can I connect it to an HDPE pipe and drain it underground to a gully trap? I fear connecting it to anything under tile as the drain lines are PVC and may not afford the pressure. Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe Are wet sprinklers required in a woodworking dust collection system with a spark detection and arrest?
Are there any limitations or hazards to installing wet heads in this system such as heads struck by small debris? Do dust collection system fall under industrial exhaust? Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe We design fire protection systems for large industrial plants with a large area network running in the kilometers.
In such case there could be chances of surge due do sudden closure of a deluge valve, check valve, or fire pump. We do not have time/expertise to carry on surge analysis on software. I have heard about using tanks for surge. How would we go about sizing an anti-surge tank? Is there any basic guidelines based on fire water flow rate/pump discharge pressure to get first cut sizing of a surge protection tank? Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe I'm reviewing a apartment building that meets the requirements for an NFPA 13R system.
My questions: A pump is going to be required for this project and they are proposing to use a booster pump on the incoming waterline at the property line to reach the required pressure for domestic and fire demands. Is a combined domestic/fire pump like this allowed? It would be a private pump. Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe I am building mid-rise wood framed multi-family buildings and am looking into some of the concealed space options available in NFPA 13.
8.15.1.2.17 permits the omission of sprinklers in the concealed space between the underside of wood joists and top of a limited combustible suspended ceiling as long as the joist space is filled with noncombustible insulation within 2 inches of subfloor above. It is 8.15.1.2.17.1 that I am looking for insight on. It requires that the exposed bottom chord of the joists that would be exposed to the concealed space is faced with a noncombustible product installed as per manufacturers specifications. Is there a product that has been recognized to satisfy this requirement? I was thinking about overlaying the fiberglass insulation used to fill the joist cavities to cover the bottom of joist. While it would be full depth in the 2x6 joist, I would compress it and mechanically fasten it so that the joists would not be exposed to the concealed space below. Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe I'm reviewing a single-family home NFPA 13D system.
What is the proper way to calculate a 13D system? Is this a 2- or 4-sprinkler calculation? Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe I am looking at a project that shows 6-inch underground lead-in to a riser room. The specs however call out the install of a 1,000 gpm pump. NFPA 20 shows that for a 1,000 gpm pump suction sizing should be no less than 8-inch diameter.
Is a 6-inch even allowed for this application? Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe What is the proper hazard classification for an enclosed loading dock?
Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe We're all about improving fire protection worldwide with quality resources and shared knowledge. Thanks to those who topped our leaderboards for August. Shoutout to three new top contributors this month Alex, John & Brian -
We have a water storage tank and a diesel fire pump on our project.
Is there any requirement for the pressure relief valve discharge pipe, when connected to a supply tank, to be extended below the lowest possible water level? Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe We are working on a project where the site engineer is asking if tapping into the underground fire line is acceptable to supply a water cooling line to a water source heat pump unit with a 3-inch line. I'm having trouble finding where it is not acceptable and thought I'd reach out to the knowledgeable members here. This site has a combination potable/fire line as shown in the picture below. Should we require them to tie into the 8-inch tap from the potable water line upstream of the fire protection vault (blue line in the drawing)? Or is it OK that they tap into the fire supply line downstream of the fire protection vault (red line below)?  Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe
Working on a new resort hotel and it is necessary to have buried pipe before and after a sprinkler control valve.
Is it allowable by code to substitute C900 PVC pipe with Tyco Blazemaster pipe? According to the installation guide of Tyco Blazemaster it could be installed underground. If not, which material can be installed instead of C900 because 4-inch is the smallest size for this pipe? Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe I'm working on an NFPA 13 three-story hotel.
Code permits residential sprinklers or quick-response sprinklers in the dwelling units and adjoining corridors. Is there any advantage to using one type of sprinkler over the other? Thanks in advance for your comments. Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe We have five, two-car-high stacking units in a basement area. We have a smoke exhaust system but also need an active protection system. NFPA 13 categorizes such arrangements as Extra Hazard (Group 2). Does anyone have experience of what would be an acceptable layout around these areas as the NFPA 13 guidance is not extensive?  Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe
I'm designing a school that has overhead doors that are 8'-0" x 7'-0" that run up above a 10'-0" or 10'-6" ceiling. The structure is non-combustible (steel beam & steel bar joist) and the walls go deck.
The opening for the door in the drop tile ceiling is an 8'-6" x 1'-0" opening. This opening does not meet the 70% open ceiling requirement and I'm not sure it meets cloud ceiling requirements. The plan reviewer is asking me to place upright sprinkler heads above the ceiling. My interpretation is that I don't need sprinklers above the ceiling. Are sprinklers required above the ceiling? Thank you in advance. Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe I am reviewing a parking garage that is 5-stories in height fully equipped with an NFPA 13 sprinkler system.
The calculations provided for floors 4 and 5 indicate an elevation of 0 at the 3rd floor riser, with the elevations going in the negative values back to the hydrant. Floor 3 calculations indicate an elevation of 0 at the Floor 2 riser. Floor 2 and 1 calculations show an elevation of 0 at the hydrant where the flow test was conducted. Does the location of the "0" elevation affect the calculations demand, if the total change in elevation is still accounted for? Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe There always seems to be controversy about residential sprinklers in the garage.
I recently came across a section in the 2018 IRC under Section 309.5 and it states that private garages shall be protected by fire sprinklers (must be residential or quick response, designed to 0.05 gpm/sqft density) where the exterior wall has been designed based on Table 302.1(2) Note A. This table addresses minimum fire resistance ratings for exterior walls. Note (a) allows fire separation distance for non-rated exterior walls and projections to be reduced to 0-feet, unlimited openings and penetrations, with a setback, where residential subdivisions are all sprinklered. While looking at that table, I am not sure how to verify on the sprinkler plans if the garage meets that design method. I have started asking the contractor to add a note on the plans regarding the design method and if they use this table and note to design the wall then sprinklers are required in the garage. How would you interpret this section for compliance? Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe I am working on a project that is manufacturing lithium-metal batteries (not lithium-ion). There are multiple areas throughout the manufacturing process where there is a risk of exposed lithium metal.
With lithium being water reactive, any water based system is not an option. Are there any known alternative fire suppression systems listed and approved for use on a lithium fire? I know that per a couple of different NFPA codes that clean agent and dry-chemical systems are not recommended for use on lithium fires. From what I can find there are just manual fire extinguishers (such and ANSUL's lith-x) for use on lithium fires. Any input would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance. Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe I'm laying out the fire sprinklers for a building where the architect has used the IBC exception in Section 403.2.1.2 that requires sprinklers to be installed at the top and alternating floor levels of a vertical shaft. This reduces the required shaft enclosure to be 1-hour for highrises up to 420 feet.
NFPA 13 doesn't seem to address this specific arrangement. I've looked and I'm not finding any installation requirements. I have concerns with just putting sprinklers in the shaft. What's the best type of sprinkler for this? Should they have water shields? Should I have concerns for obstructions? Any guidance would be greatly appreciated, thanks in advance. Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe |
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