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A resident in our area is planning to install ground-mounted solar for an existing home, along with storing the energy produced in batteries. The area for the batteries (ESS - Energy Storage Systems) is a storage room which is accessible only through the inside of their garage. Would this storage area still be considered a "living area" and thus subject to the max 20kWh of ESS per the IFC section 1207.1.1 (table)? Or, could they store more batteries in this area since it's only accessible via the garage area? 
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I've always wondered, how do the responding fire personnel holding the nozzle of a hose attached to a standpipe deal with the slugs of compressed air?
What happens with a hose/nozzle when a large, class I dry manual standpipe system is getting slammed with 150 psi (or more) of water pushing all that air? Do they purge air before hooking up the hose? How about a wet manual standpipe where the FDC is several sticks of 6" pipe from the check valve? What's it like on the end of the hose when that slug of air arrives with 150-175 psi of water in front and behind it? Are there any firefighters out there experienced in standpipe operations who care to share? Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe We have a scenario where the fire riser will be installed after the building is completed. If the pipe is located below the pedestrian walkway area, is this required to comply with NFPA 13, 2022, (6.4.2.2.2 In locations where freezing is not a factor, the depth of cover shall not be less than 30 in. (750 mm) below grade to prevent mechanical damage. [24:10.4.2.2.2])? See the attached sketch. If yes, what is the possible solution? Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe  Today's post from Joe Meyer, MeyerFire: Many of you who are regularly on the Forum here may not regularly keep up with what we have over on the blog side of things - The past few weeks we've worked to build a community-input open fire sprinkler specification. We spoke about ideas to fix it, but the goal is to give a baseline basic specification that's clear, unambiguous, concise, relevant to today easy to read, and easy to edit. We have a drafted version and are very interested in your input for improvement - see this link to download and comment on it. What doesn't work? What isn't practical? What good practice would you like to see included?  Thanks for being a part of making positive change happen for the industry!
- Joe Consider a multi-story building with floor control valves (FCV) at each level.
Is a main drain test required to be performed at each of the floor control valves and tagged at startup? Is a hydraulic placard required at each floor control valve? If so, is the base of riser pressure to be the pressure at floor control valve or at the base of riser in the sprinkler riser room? Is it allowable to hang each of the floor's hydraulic placard together at the main riser in the sprinkler riser room? Thanks in advance. Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe When conducting main drain test on a sprinkler system with a fire pump, should the pump be on or off?
AHJ generally wants the pump to be on in this area. Thanks. Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe We have an overhead ESFR sprinkler system under NFPA 13-2013 with K22.4 sprinklers.
There are ducts 14-inches to 20-inches in diameter that will be installed at 30-ft. What is the required separation distance for them to be considered separate obstructions where we can omit sprinklers below, as long as they are 24" away (horizontal) from the overhead sprinklers? Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe NFPA 13 Section A.9.4.2.5 provides additional detail for temperature ratings of sprinklers located near horizontal hot air diffusers.
However, I cannot find anywhere that says specifically where the measurement is to be taken from. Is the 2'-6" measured from the edge of the diffuser in all directions, or should it be measured as a 2'-6" radius from the center of the diffuser? Thanks in advance! Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe From the 2023 Edition of NFPA 855, Section 14.6.4 "Outdoor storage areas with an aggregate area greater than 400 sqft (37.1 sqm) shall be provided with a fire alarm system activated by a radiant-energy detection system with occupant notification installed in accordance with NFPA 72."
How do you interpret this requirement if there is outdoor storage of Li-Ion batteries without any sort of structure and 300' from any building, and there are no occupants to notify? Thanks for your help! Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe How do you size a water storage tank for fire flow when the city supply is significant, but not sufficient for Fire Flow?
For instance, if I have 1,500 gpm available from the city at 20 psi, but I need 2,000 gpm for Fire Flow, is the water storage tank sized for 500gpm for the required duration? Or do I need to size the tank for the entire 2,000 gpm minus reliable refill? Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe Can a 4" pump with 4"-6" discharge fitting be used on a private 10" combination line (fire suppression and hydrants)?
NFPA 24 Section 13.1 states that no line less than 6" shall service a hydrant. But does the fact that NFPA 20 Section 4.16 allows the 4"-6" discharge fitting as part of the pump assembly overrule this? Thanks in advance. Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe When are pressure reducing hose valves required on a dry automatic standpipe system?
I have a project where I have been asked to evaluate an existing sprinkler system for an 8-story apartment building. The original installation falls under NFPA 13/14/20 2013 edition. The building is served by four dry automatic standpipes and a separate wet sprinkler feed. The standpipes are not combination sprinkler/standpipes. The fire pump churn pressure is 212 psi and there is a pressure reducing valve provided for the wet system supply. There is no pressure reducing valve for the dry automatic standpipes. The hose valves on the standpipes are the pressure restricting type. Not pressure reducing. When reviewing the data sheets for the hose valves, it states "Adjustable restriction of pressures up to 175 lbs....at residual flow" but the valves themselves are rated to 300 psi. At normal, non-fire conditions, the standpipes have 23 psi static pressure of air, but if the dry valve were to trip for any reason, (non-fire or not) the standpipe exceeds 175psi static pressure on the 1st-7th floors. NFPA 14 2013 states that "7.2.3.2* Where the static pressure at a 21⁄2 in. (65 mm) hose connection exceeds 175 psi (12.1 bar), an approved pressure regulating device shall be provided to limit static and residual pressures at the outlet of the hose connection to 175 psi (12.1 bar)." Would the static pressure be considered the normal air pressure or the static pressure if the dry valve trips? My assumption here would be that the pressure restricting valve needs to be swapped for a pressure reducing type. Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe I have a canopy that is completely detached from a building (school) and is an entirely a separate structure. The canopy has no walls and is not in an egress pathway. The canopy is used for bicycle storage and bicycles are not stored overnight.
Is there any code path to require sprinklers underneath this canopy? If not, what is the code path to omit fire sprinkler protection? Thanks for your help! Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe Are there any universal, non-AHJ-specific requirements for permitting sprinkler alterations and/or repairs?
I have been told that “code” requires a permit to be pulled for any and all sprinkler alterations. Upon further questioning, I determined that this came from a fire marshal showing my colleague something in the IBC once, but, even if that were true, wouldn’t that still require adoption and implementation by a jurisdiction? Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe Does a security grill utilized in school corridors required to be tied into the fire alarm?
If so, the concept should be that the grill in the closed position should return to the open position when fire alarm is activated, correct? Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe What is the difference between the terms "permitted" and "required" in NFPA standards?
For example, a later chapter will say that "Smokeproof enclosures complying with 7.2.3 shall be permitted.", which will point you back to: 7.2.3.1 General. "Where smokeproof enclosures are required in other sections of this Code, they shall comply with 7.2.3, unless they are approved existing smokeproof enclosures." The "parent" section uses the phrase "where 'required' elsewhere", while the occupancy-specific section uses "permitted", as in allowed to be required, without specifically requiring it. This feels very cyclic. Am I directed back to the separation requirements of Chapter 6, or is there something buried in the occupancy chapter that I am not seeing? Thanks in advance. Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe Does any one know in 1960's and 1970's, what the flow and pressure requirements of 1-1/2 inch standpipe system hose of NFPA 14?
This would be for a Class II system. Thanks in advance. Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe Can window sprinklers be used to protect internal glazing in partitions in lieu of fire rated glass partition?
The life safety engineer has requested to provide sprinklers on internal fully glazed partitions to save the cost of fire rated glazed partition. Not for the entire hospital, only some internal partitions in a hospital for glazing with 1-hour fire rated ones. Although couldn't find anything in the NFPA 13 that support his request as I know this is valid only for atriums, am I right? I appreciate the help and response as always. Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe If you've enjoyed being part of the community and are looking to make a greater impact in the industry - consider joining up with us! We have a few part time opportunities currently open where you can earn on the side and make a greater impact in the industry. More details here:
Is there any code that requires that fire alarm coverage be provided in areas that are in the process of major modifications, including asbestos abatement work?
We have a project which will undergo major asbestos abatement and are getting pushback that the fire alarm system must remain operational in the space during the renovation work. Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe I have seen this method of arranging fire suppression components (see attached schematic) several times where I live. The attached is a partial re-creation of the fire water entry schematic for a high-rise building with a fire pump. The system has low and high pressure zones. The underground parking dry systems are served by the municipal water directly, and the standpipes and aboveground sprinklers are fed by the pump.  Questions: 1. Can you have a FDC serving the low pressure zones as shown on the suction side of the pump per NFPA-14 6.4.3.1? 2. If not, how should the schematic be arranged instead? 3. What could happen if the Low Pressure FDC were pressurized as shown? This project was built under the 2013 editions of NFPA-13, 14, and 20. I am asking because I am beginning design of a sprinkler system for a 22 story high-rise. Thanks for your help. Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe Hi all, what is the maximum length of the connection from the hydrant to the fire water main?
NFPA 24 mentions that the minimum size is 6" but couldn't find anything related to the pipe length. Thanks Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe Another month, another 20+ great discussions happening on the Forum. Thanks to all those who have contributed! Here are the Top Ten from April:
Is it code-mandated to have two control valves in the fire pump bypass piping?
Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe What design considerations (if any) need to be taken into account for the new refrigerant changes that are coming up for the HVAC industry (slightly flammable or highly flammable refrigerants)? Are there any code updates, guidelines reference materials etc. Would this possibly affect hazard classifications? Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe  |
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