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Who is Responsible for Fire Flow?

2/1/2019

5 Comments

 
As a fire sprinkler system designer/engineer we often get asked about fire flow for new construction buildings. It seems as though anything that has "fire" in its name is then directly sent our way, but fire flow for a building does not relate to the interior fire sprinkler system and is typically not something we do. I don't come across many civil engineers who understand or cover fire flow either.

Is this supposed to be (or typically) handled by the civil engineer? For MEP/FP or fire sprinkler contractors, do you typically provide fire flow calculations to verify the water supply to the site?

Posted anonymously by a member for discussion. Discuss this  | Subscribe 
5 Comments
Wayne Ammons
2/1/2019 07:25:35 am

I am not aware of any code requirement that needed fire flow be calculated by a specific trade or engineer. However, it is typically deferred to the civil engineer. Unless a local code, AHJ, or statute specifies who is to provide the calculation, the person should be qualified and familiar with the site in question. He or she should also be familiar with the numerous methods available and which method the local code, AHJ, or statute may require.

This document provides a lot of information concerning fire flow methodologies:

https://www.nfpa.org/-/media/Files/News-and-Research/Fire-statistics-and-reports/Emergency-responders/RFEvaluationofFireFlowMethodologies.ashx?la=en

Reply
Mike
2/1/2019 10:06:11 am

Typically, as part of the building deign process, the civil engineer will submit a Will Serve letter from the water purveyor that indicates available flow. However, this letter has never been accepted as a flow test to determine water supply availability for the fire sprinkler system.

Reply
Rusty Scott
2/1/2019 12:17:37 pm

Just ran into this myself, where a fire marshal requested the fire flow to be 8,000 gpm at 20 psi, which left me at a loss for words until I found out it is civil's responsibility to calculate and is not the same as the flow test info we are use to seeing from a hydrant flow test.

Reply
Brian Gerdwagen FPE
2/1/2019 01:13:48 pm

I have always done the fire flow as well as the fire flow test for buildings I design. Both when I worked for a sprinkler contractor and now that I work for an engineering firm.

This should never be left up to the Civil Engineer.

In regards to the 8,000gpm at 20psi, remember that there is a reduction of up to 75% with a 1500gpm minimum in the IFC. Do not let that high number scare you.

For projects that require compliance with the UFC, the FPE must conduct or direct the flow test personally prior to the first design submittal.

Reply
Civil Engineer link
1/20/2021 12:40:10 pm

This article is very helpful for an engineer. Your are very nicely present in the <a href="https://www.civilengineer9.com/responsibility-of-civil-site-engineer/">roles and responsibility of an engineer</a>.

Reply



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  • Blog
  • Forum
  • THE TOOLKIT
    • SUBMIT AN IDEA
    • BACKFLOW DATABASE*
    • CLEAN AGENT ESTIMATOR*
    • CLOUD CEILING CALCULATOR
    • DOMESTIC DEMAND*
    • FIRE FLOW CALCULATOR*
    • FIRE PUMP ANALYZER*
    • FIRE PUMP DATABASE*
    • FRICTION LOSS CALCULATOR
    • HANGER SPACER*
    • IBC TRANSLATOR*
    • K-FACTOR SELECTOR*
    • NFPA 13 EDITION TRANSLATOR ('19 ONLY)
    • NFPA 13 EDITION TRANSLATOR ('99-'22)*
    • LIQUIDS ANALYZER*
    • OBSTRUCTION CALCULATOR
    • OBSTRUCTIONS AGAINST WALL*
    • PLUMBING FIXTURE COUNTS
    • QUICK RESPONSE AREA REDUCTION
    • REMOTE AREA ANALYZER*
    • SPRINKLER DATABASE*
    • SPRINKLER FLOW*
    • SYSTEM ESTIMATOR*
    • TEST & DRAIN CALCULATOR
    • THRUST BLOCK CALCULATOR
    • TRAPEZE CALCULATOR
    • UNIT CONVERTER
    • VOLUME & COMPRESSOR CALCULATOR
    • WATER STORAGE*
    • WATER SUPPLY (US)
    • WATER SUPPLY (METRIC)
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    • JOIN
    • CATALOG
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