Two-Way Comm. Req'd for Convenience Elevator?

6/2/2021

Is a two way communication system required when an elevator is installed (only for convenience) but is NOT required or designed to be part of the accessible means of egress - assuming none of the exceptions in 1009.8 apply?

Refer to CBC 1009.8: "A two-way communication system complying with Sections 1009.8.1 and 1009.8.2 shall be provided at the landing serving each elevator or bank of elevators on each accessible floor that is one or more stories above or below the level of exit discharge."

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6 Comments

Sandy

6/2/2021 08:19:22 am

Yes, per ASME/ANSI 17.1-2.27.1.1.1 (2019) a communication means between the car and a location staffed by those that can take action must be provided. You don't want someone stuck in an elevator with no way of contacting someone for help.

Jesse Cecil

6/2/2021 08:36:37 am

Yes. Regardless of whether it was installed because of a code requirement or as a convenience, there exists the potential for a person to be trapped inside.

James

6/2/2021 09:27:22 am

I don't think the two-way communication system is intended to serve those inside the elevator, only outside at the landings. As Brian/Chad say below, I believe it's for those who could be trapped on a floor outside of an elevator.

These systems are required "on each accessible floor".

Is the floor considered to be accessible? If so, the system would be required. Is the floor not accessible? Then the system would not be required.

The two-way communication system isn't dependent on the ELEVATOR being designed as accessible or not, but rather if the FLOOR LEVEL is considered accessible.

Brian Gerdwagen FPE

6/2/2021 09:06:38 am

To clarify, the elevator does not need to be designed as an accessible means of egress to require the two-way communication.

The requirement is there to provide a way to signal first responders that someone is trapped on the floor and in need of rescue assistance.

chad

6/2/2021 09:22:58 am

I am having a bit of trouble concurring with this.

The comm. system is certainly required at those elevators that are "part of an accessible means of egress" but if the elevator is not, then is it really required?

1009.1 says "accessible means of egress" shall comply with this section, is a "convenience" elevator part of it? (I admit there is no definition of a convenience elevator, heck there is no definition of an elevator in IBC now that I look!)

1009.4 Elevators. In order to be considered part of an accessible
means of egress, an elevator shall comply ..... this indicates that all elevators are not part of an assessible means of egress

This is where it gets a bit muddy.....

1009.8 Two-way communication. A two-way communication
system complying with Sections 1009.8.1 and 1009.8.2
shall be provided at the landing serving each elevator or bank
of elevators on each accessible floor that is one or more stories
above or below the level of exit discharge

It says for 'each' elevator, but 1009.1 says that if its not part of the 'accessible means of egress' this sections does not apply

hmmm?

Todd E Wyatt

6/2/2021 10:45:54 am

Per the reference to "CBC", I will assume that this question is refencing the 2019 California Building Code (https://codes.iccsafe.org/content/CBC2019P4).

If a story is required to have at least (2) Means of Egress (MOE) based on Occupant Load capacity and/or to meet the MOE Travel Distances, the story is required to have at least (2) Accessible Means of Egress (AMOE) per CBC Section 1009. There are (10) different types of AMOE as listed in 1009.2 of which an elevator is one type of AMOE. If the building has a (required) accessible story that is 4 or more stories above the level of Exit Discharge, then an elevator MUST be one of the two AMOE. Whether an elevator is required to be an AMOE on Stories 1-3 could be up to interpretation.

If on Story 05, for example, the Design Professional has designated Elevator A and Interior Exit Stairway A (IES-A) as the (2) AMOE, the other (convenience) Elevator B and IES-B are not required AMOE. I have had AHJs require signage be added at these non-required AMOE directing occupants to the locations of the two-way communication.

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Two-Way Comm. Req'd for Convenience Elevator?

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