Survivability for Elevator Landing Comm. System?

7/20/2022

A question came to me about the survivability requirements for an elevator landing communication system required by 2018 IBC 1009.8/NFPA 101 7.2.12.1. 2016 is the applicable NFPA 72 edition.

The designer is arguing that since NFPA 72 Section 24.3.13 doesn't call out "elevator landing communication systems" by name that it falls under Section 24.3.13.12 and requires a risk analysis. They did note that the 2019 edition "clears up some confusion" but don't mention that the 2019 edition modifies section 24.3.7.2 to reference "elevator landing communication systems" and refer their design to the area of refuge/rescue assistance section 24.10 along with stair communication systems.

The 2016 edition of 24.3.7.2 just references "elevator emergency communication systems, section 24.11" which is pretty clearly about the in-car call systems, not the systems required at the landings by IBC/101.

Now I've done my homework, its pretty clear that from 2016-2019 NFPA wants elevator landing communication systems to meet the same requirements as an area of refuge communication system, and from 2019-2022 its explicitly clear that the elevator landing communication systems need to be robust; further more the commentary language of the IBC, NFPA 101 and NFPA 72 for the elevator landing and area of refuge communication systems all pretty much say the same thing that non-self-evacuating occupants needs a reliable means of communication for the duration they remain in the building, so the two systems would need to function the same.

My problem is that for the 2016 edition this is all implied and implicit language.

I am very confident that elevator landing systems require the same survivability as area of refuge systems but can't find an explicit code reference to support it. Is there a section/commentary section/something I'm missing?

Thanks in advance.

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7 Comments

Mitchell O

7/20/2022 10:55:34 am

While I agree that 2019 adds elevator landing communication systems whereas 2016 did not specifically reference that type of system, did the survivability requirements change for that system from 2016 to 2019? (2019) 24.3.7.2 does add occupant evacuation elevator lobby communication systems and points to you Section 24.10, however, 24.10 doesn't appear to speak directly to the requirements for survivability.

Survivability is required by (2019) 24.3.14 and the language under section 24.3.14.10 for elevator emergency communication systems is unchanged from 2016 to 2019 that requires Level 0 through 3. Also somewhat interest that 2019 removed 24.11 for elevator emergency communication systems.

Not sure I have an answer but just workshopping here in an attempt to help. If the designer feels under 2016 this falls back on risk analysis, what is their justification via that risk analysis that the elevator emergency communication systems requires less survivability than an area of refuge?

7/20/2022 12:50:06 pm

They didn't put one in the RFI or any justification, their position was level 1 was sufficient.

I would argue that the survivability requirements didn't change since I believe elevator landing systems fall under area of refuge. The use of the systems are the same and the language in the appendix/Handbook editions make that pretty clear.

I would also argue that an elevator landing system and an elevator emergency communication system are two different system; one is in car for occupants trapped in the elevator and the other is for the lobby for occupants who cant self evacuate the building.

Something interesting I found was that NFPA 101 pretty much has the same requirements as the IBC but it doesn't call it a "elevator landing communication system," it just calls it a two way communicator in an area of refuge. To me that solidifies that NFPA intents for all the two way communication systems for non-self evacuating occupants to fall into the same requirements and the change from 2016 to 2019 was to ease the confusion with the language in IBC. The 2022 edition adds more updates for the elevator landing system as well, very similar to area of refuge requirements and its given its own section.

Todd E Wyatt

7/21/2022 11:18:56 am

The adopted Code (2018 IBC) is the scoping document that identifies IF an Emergency Communications Systems (ECS) is required for a Project.

Per 2018 IBC Ch 30 Elevators & Conveyance Systems, it references the following "two-way communication" :

3001.2 Emergency Elevator Communication Systems for the Deaf, Hard of Hearing and Speech Impaired
An emergency two-way communication system shall be provided that:
1. Is a visual and text-based and a video-based 24/7 live interactive system.
2. Is fully accessible by the deaf, hard of hearing and speech impaired, and shall include voice-only options for hearing individuals.
3. Has the ability to communicate with emergency personnel utilizing existing video conferencing technology, chat/text software or other approved technology.

3008.6 Occupant Evacuation Elevator Lobby (Not applicable?)
3008.6.6 Two-Way Communication System
A two-way communication system shall be provided in each occupant evacuation elevator lobby ...

Per the scoping Code, it states that “emergency two-way communication system shall be provided.”

The 2018 IBC Ch 30 does not specifically reference 2016 NFPA 72 as the reference standard for the design, installation, maintenance, and testing of the “emergency two-way communication system”. NFPA 72 is referenced in 3005.5 Shunt Trip and in 3007.7. Elevator System Monitoring.

Per the 2018 IBC Ch 35 Referenced Standards, 2016 NFPA 72 is referenced per the following sections : 407.4.4.3, 407.4.4.5, 407.4.4.5.1, 901.6, 903.4.1, 904.3.5, 907.1.2, 907.2, 907.2.6, 907.2.9.3, 907.2.10, 907.2.12.2, 907.3, 907.3.3, 907.3.4, 907.5.2.1.2, 907.5.2.2, 907.5.2.2.5, 907.6, 907.6.1, 907.6.2, 907.6.6, 907.7, 907.7.1, 907.7.2, 911.1.6, 917.1, 2702.2.4, 3005.5, 3007.7.

The 2016 IBC also references ASME/A17.1—2016/CSA B44—16 Safety Code for Elevators and Escalators and A17.7—2007/CSA B44—07(R2012) Performance-based Safety Code for Elevators and Escalators.

The 2019 edition of the ASME/A17.1 CSA B44—16 Safety Code for Elevators and Escalators states the following :
NONMANDATORY APPENDIX V
BUILDING FEATURES FOR OCCUPANT EVACUATION OPERATION
V-1.l Occupant Evacuation Operation.
(c] An emergency voice/alarm communications system meeting the requirements of NFPA 72 is provided to inform occupants on each floor of the current situation and actions to take in an emergency. The announcements should include information about whether or not the elevators are available.

7/21/2022 12:27:49 pm

Thats for the in car system, what I'm talking about is the at-landing system thats required if there are no areas of refuge.

7/21/2022 11:19:29 am

I agree with your stance that it all seems logical and "makes sense" but I am not sure the code path is there in 2016. If the entire question is about survivability, this appears to come down to NFPA 72 (2016) 24.3.13 and elevator landing communication system are not mentioned. You noted above that you feel that elevator landing communication system are different than elevator emergency communication system (which is noted in 24.3.13.10). So it seems that 24.3.13.12 would be applicable as "all other emergency communication systems" and require a risk analysis.

7/21/2022 12:42:36 pm

Something I noticed after my original post was that NFPA 101 doesn't use the same language as the IBC for these systems. In jurisdictions where IBC CH10 isn't adopted and NFPA 101 is used, or where 101 and IBC are adopted concurrently I think the language of NFPA 101 is pretty clear that an elevator landing communication system is the same as an area of refuge communication system in NFPA's eyes.

7/21/2022 12:52:21 pm

Just reading NPFA 101 now, I agree, that it speaks to elevator landings requiring two-way communication systems under the area of refuge section. If NFPA 101 was the governing code, this would simply require that such a system be installed. It would be up to NFPA 72 to provide the specifics of how it gets installed, which still brings you back to the survivability section of 72 where it lists area of refuge separate from anything elevator related.

Survivability for Elevator Landing Comm. System?

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