Fire Service Required to Run Underneath Footing?

7/12/2023

Are you required by NFPA 24 to enter a building underneath the foundation, or can you enter a building with the the fire service main from the side of the building?

Many are under the impression that due to the fact all illustrations in NFPA 24 show the fire main entering under the building, footing/foundation, that this suggests that it is a requirement.

Please can someone shed some light on this?

Regards.

Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe

10 Comments

Pete H

7/12/2023 06:49:13 am

From NFPA 24 (2019 ed.)

10.2.3: "Where fittings installed in a private fire service main must be installed above grade, the fittings shall conform to NFPA 13.

Additionally, Chapters 12 and 13 specifically refer to aboveground fire service mains (13 also refers to buried pipe).

I'm pretty sure you can have an aboveground incoming service, however it will require measures of frost protection, be that by conforming to NFPA 13 and 24 rules for exposed piping through heating the pipe or just being in an area that never cares about aboveground pipe freezing (like those parts where you see the exposed backflow devices outside every building).

My take: You can do it, but it's asking for some frozen pipe and damaged pipe. Typically you're tapping into an underground and often water authorities have additional requirements for the pathways of the utilities they have jurisdiction over, which may directly forbid exposed incoming services in their jurisdiction. So I'd still advise against it.

Anthony

7/12/2023 08:09:09 am

I agree with Pete here that it's a bad idea. However, I have seen this where "aboveground underground service" will hop from one building to another especially in an industrial setting. Usually its heat traced and wrapped.

Also tank feeds can be above ground and heat traced into a building.

Jesse

7/12/2023 08:29:07 am

Yep you can. And in areas not prone to freezing, its pretty common. A lot of Southern CA has riser outside the building. The issue being freeze protection and fittings. Once the underground isn't under-ground anymore, the fittings need to comply with 13, not 24.

7/12/2023 08:31:24 am

I second both Pete and Anthony--

We generally don't allow that type of arrangement unless there are extenuating design circumstances, typically with a retrofit. And then they must show compliance with requirements for freeze protection and impact protection.

Dan Wilder

7/12/2023 09:10:40 am

Happens a lot in the Southwest. Sometimes by design, sometimes because the GC was in such a hurry to get concrete down for a work surface, they didn't think about the fire line stub up (which is often a scope gap between the underground and overhead contractors anyway).

If you look at the other side, there is nothing preventing that installation especially when the book has provisions when it is installed in this method.

As Pete said,
24-22'-10.2.3.1 for above ground fittings
24-22'-10.4.2.1.4 for freeze protection

Josh

7/12/2023 09:44:08 am

I don't allow it or do it under the footing because what if the pipe were to burst and water was to the point it made the footer unstable with it being completely below it. I ask my structural guys to drop the footers 2 ft and I go through them.

Fred Walker

7/12/2023 10:10:04 am

By code above ground, through foundation, or under foundation is permitted. Each method has specific requirements, advantages, and disadvantages.

Where large fire service mains are underground significant facility damage is possible should a leak or break occur.

Where mains are above ground weather protection can be critical especially in locations not normally subject to abnormally cold temperature since maintenance features may not be appropriately serviced.

Janak Patel

7/12/2023 10:44:49 am

Code, NFPA 24 nor NFPA 13 prohibit an above ground entry of a fire water feed to a building. As mentioned by many of the commentators, a 'freeze protection' system is required in a areas where the ambient temperature could go below 32 deg. F.

Also, if the external wall, through which the fire water feed line is entering a building, is a 'fire rated wall', then the piping penetration shall be a fire rated one.

Glenn Berger

7/12/2023 11:40:14 am

In your case there is one one answer fits all cases. If you are in a non-freeze environment, it is common to have the sprinkler riser and backflow preventor outside the building. When you need to be underground to enter the building, coordinate with the structural engineer.

Chris Hall

7/13/2023 01:51:00 pm

Down in Texas buildings have the UG rise up above the slab and then turn to go in to the building through the exterior wall all the time; especially in retrofit situations. And they work really well. If you are worried about freezing we have seen the GC build little "dog houses" around that exterior pipe with insulated walls and then make the opening where the pipe in penetrating the exterior wall of the building really oversize or the size of the "dog house". In Florida there are tons of complete risers outside that turn and go in to the building after the flow switch and all that stuff.

Leave a Reply.

Home
Our Cause

The Blog
The Forum

PE Exam Prep
The Toolkit
MeyerFire University

Pricing
Login
Support
Contact Us

MeyerFire.com is a startup community built to help fire protection professionals shine.
Our goal is to improve fire protection practices worldwide. We promote the industry by creating helpful tools and resources, and by bringing together industry professionals to share their expertise.

MeyerFire, LLC is a NICET Recognized Training Provider and International Code Council Preferred Education Provider.
All text, images, and media Copyright © 2016-2024 MeyerFire, LLC

We respect your privacy and personal data. See our Privacy Policy and Terms of Service. The views, opinions, and information found on this site represent solely the author and do not represent the opinions of any other party, nor does the presented material assume responsibility for its use. Fire protection and life safety systems constitute a critical component for public health and safety and you should consult with a licensed professional for proper design and code adherence.

Discussions are solely for the purpose of peer review and the exchange of ideas. All comments are reviewed. Comments which do not contribute, are not relevant, are spam, or are disrespectful in nature may be removed. Information presented and opinions expressed should not be relied upon as a replacement for consulting services. Some (not all) outbound links on this website, such as Amazon links, are affiliate-based where we receive a small commission for orders placed elsewhere.

Fire Service Required to Run Underneath Footing?

Leave a Reply.

ALL-ACCESS

SUBSCRIBE

COMMUNITY

YOUR POST

PE EXAM

FILTERS

ARCHIVES

PE PREP SERIES