Any Way to Partially Sprinkler New A-3 Church?

11/17/2023

We are building a church under the 2018 IBC. It's an A-3 occupancy. We're trying to figure out if we really need a fire suppression system in the whole building and if there are any alternatives given the exorbitant costs to cover the whole building.

Based on my research the only two things that would necessitate a system is the fact that we have a choir loft up a flight of stairs with no fire escape (except the staircase) and the main body of the chapel could possibly fit about 300 people.

We were wondering if we could just cover the fire areas without covering the whole building?

We've gotten differing answers from both the county and fire marshal. I contacted the state department for a final verdict but I could really use some expertise input. Our pastor is concerned that we may be getting upsold into a product that we may not need, especially since they wanted sprinklers in an inaccessible crawl space.

Thanks for all the help, this site has been extremely helpful. Do let me know if there are any viable alternatives and any other way to help on costs.

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17 Comments

Pete H

11/17/2023 07:40:18 am

Without knowing square footage and construction type it's impossible to say for certain.

But if it's got an occupancy of 300 people, and it's a church.... it's likely combustible wood construction, which is why you would have to protect the inaccessible crawlspace if you were to protect the entire building.

Dave

11/17/2023 11:27:35 am

Wouldn't the crawl space, combustible or not, fall under the NFPA #13 exception, meeting:

1. ...not accessible for storage...
2. ...contains no equipment...
3. ...tight construction...
4. No combustible or flammable liquids or materials...on the floor above

David Kendrick

11/17/2023 08:06:13 am

It's like paraphrasing the advice from your dentist.

"Only put fire sprinklers in the parts you want to keep."

Bob

11/17/2023 08:14:29 am

NFPA states entire premesis must be sprinklered.
Usually in cases where sprinklers ar not necessarily called for, your local Fire Marshal can sanction, at his duscretion, a limited area system.
Your underwiter will also need to be on board.
Most Fire Marshals are leery of second-guessing adopted construction standards, but some feel that some level of protection is better than nothing.

Alex

11/17/2023 08:18:13 am

If you are required to have a sprinkler system (based on area/height/occupancy), then you need to provide a complete NFPA 13 system. If you have combustible construction, that would require you to install sprinklers throughout concealed spaces.

Darin Golden

11/17/2023 08:21:21 am

903.2.1.3Group A-3.
An automatic sprinkler system shall be provided throughout stories containing Group A-3 occupancies and throughout all stories from the Group A-3 occupancy to and including the levels of exit discharge serving that occupancy where one of the following conditions exists:

1.The fire area exceeds 12,000 square feet (1115 m2).
2.The fire area has an occupant load of 300 or more.
3.The fire area is located on a floor other than a level of exit discharge serving such occupancies.
4. The structure exceeds 12,000 square feet (1155 m2), contains more than one fire area containing exhibition and display rooms, and is separated into two or more buildings by fire walls of less than 4-hour fire-resistance rating without openings.

11/17/2023 08:25:55 am

Sorry, the above is from the IFC(scoping code) in your case. Your architect can alter the building to avoid fire sprinklers based upon the above and IBC Ch.5 (general heights, stories and areas). With that said, if a fire sprinkler is required, you might as well sprinkler the whole building as the majority of the cost is already spent on the supply, major components, etc.

Anthony

11/17/2023 08:31:45 am

This is the building code that will determine fi you need a system. It's possible to have a small church unsprinkled but anything in the ball park of high school auditorium is going to need a sprinkler system.

There is no building code option for "partially sprinkler" with A-3 new construction. You might be able to get a variance?

On the crawl space, yeah if its occupiable then it'll require sprinklers especially if you have combustible construction (wood.)

Darin

11/17/2023 08:39:47 am

Yes there is.

2 story building with Group A-3 on first floor with group B above and separated by fire barriers between floors. Assuming the Grouo A-3 exceeds the sprinklered threshold's and the building doesn’t exceed the general heights and areas analysis of IBC ch 5 to trigger sprinklers through. In accordance with the IFC code section above. The IFC and IBC ch.9 (scoping for sprinklers) is identical.

Jesse

11/17/2023 08:25:00 am

This is a really bad idea.

Partially sprinklering a building is essentially not sprinklering a building. Sprinkler systems are designed to contain a fire within a design area, preventing lateral spread.

So a fire originating in the non-sprinklered area is going to take the building - including the limited areas you have sprinklers.

Glenn Berger

11/17/2023 08:46:01 am

A complete code analysis is required here. Cannot give advice on the minimum amount of information provided.

Eric R

11/17/2023 09:19:10 am

Since everyone has covered the code requirement aspect I'll chime in on the other half of this coin: "exorbitant costs"

If this building is new construction there are tons of options available to a designer to reduce the cost of the system through smart design.

Some off the cuff ideas (that may or may not apply)
1. Can the attic sprinkler protection be made a wet system by moving the building's insulation shell from the floor of the attic to the ceiling. A wet sprinkler attic design has tremendous savings through removal of the dry valve equipment, and through lower design flow demand, which could reduce costs associated with your water supply.

2. Speaking of which, what is the water supply? If the building is rural and needs a tank and pump then there is even more incentive to insure that all available options are used to reduce the system's waterflow requirements which could significantly reduce tank size and fire pump horsepower.

3. Alternatively if you are on a good utility water supply where you have plenty of flow, a designer could go the opposite route and utilize the "below ground floors" exception to remove those sprinklers from the crawlspace with the trade-off of having to increase the design area in the space above, which for light hazard might not have a significant effect on sizing.

11/17/2023 11:43:59 am

Agreed - Involving a fire protection professional (from the engineering side or from the contracting side) in the building design can help mitigate costs of sprinklering. I have seen many creative approaches to solving the design and cost issues inherent in these types of buildings, such as eliminating dry-systems, the use of CPVC where allowed, and attic-style sprinklers. These types of projects often have funding issues, sometimes resulting in a phased approach, and committees that may or may not have construction experience. Just research how many fires there are in are nationwide, I believe it is in the best long term interest of everyone to have a fully sprinklered building.
http://www.nysafc.org/Religious%20Property%20Structure%20Fire%20Fact%20Sheet-NFPA.pdf

Dustin

11/17/2023 12:12:27 pm

Consider appealing to your community. We've done pro-bono engineering, design and installation for local churches and non-profits with smaller non-combustible occupancies. A problem right now is everyone who is worth using is busy. However, you might find a reputable and like-minded firm that would serve you at cost only. It's happened before!

Todd Wyatt

11/20/2023 09:13:11 am

SUMMARY
Yes, a building can be divided into separate Fire Areas (FA) by Fire Barriers (FB) that also serve as Occupancy Classification (OC) separations … some FAs can be protected by an automatic sprinkler system (ASPS) while others are not UNLESS one of the OCs requires the building to be protected “throughout”.

EXPLANATION
The scoping Code (e.g. IBC-2018) determines WHERE an automatic sprinkler system (ASPS) is required to be provide based on either the Occupancy Classification(s) (OC) (Sections 903.2.1 through 903.2.10) and/or "Specific Building Areas and Hazards" (903.2.11).

Parts of this church would be classified as a “Group A-3 Assembly”.

Section 303 Assembly Group A
303.1 Assembly Group A
Assembly Group A occupancy includes, among others, the use of a building or structure, or a portion thereof, for the gathering of persons for purposes such as civic, social or RELIGIOUS functions; recreation, food or drink consumption or awaiting transportation.
303.4 Assembly Group A-3
Group A-3 occupancy includes assembly uses intended for worship, recreation or amusement and other assembly uses not classified elsewhere in Group A including, but not limited to: Places of religious worship

Other parts of the church that do not have an Occupant Load of 100 occupants or more could be classified as another OC.

303.1.4 Accessory to Places of Religious Worship
Accessory religious educational rooms and religious auditoriums with occupant loads of less than 100 per room or space are not considered separate occupancies.

Once the OCs are determined, then Chapter 9 Fire Protection and Life Safety Systems determines WHERE an ASPS is required.

IBC-2021
Chapter 9 Fire Protection and Life Safety Systems
Section 903 Automatic Sprinkler Systems
903.2.1.3 Group A-3
An automatic sprinkler system shall be provided throughout stories containing Group A-3 occupancies and throughout all stories from the Group A-3 occupancy to and including the levels of exit discharge serving that occupancy where one of the following conditions exists:
1. The fire area exceeds 12,000 square feet (1115 m2).
2. The fire area has an occupant load of 300 or more.
3. The fire area is located on a floor other than a level of exit discharge serving such occupancies.

IF the A-3 OC portions meet ONE of the above (3) conditions, an ASPS is required.

Other OCs, like Group B Business, do not have requirements for ASPS protection.

Ron link

11/21/2023 11:45:40 am

We can protect the crawl spaces with condensed aerosol without running any piping etc. which makes the pricing much more reasonable.

James Art FPE

11/22/2023 10:45:39 am

Obviously this religious person doesn't believe in fire protection for his building or congregation,.
I met one pastor who said: God will protect him,
so he didn't need 2 exits from the large basement assembly hall!

This is where Laws and Code Enforcement save lives and property.

Any Way to Partially Sprinkler New A-3 Church?

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