Dry Manual Standpipes Require Supervisory Air?

4/4/2022

Do any of your projects with dry manual standpipes hold supervisory air?

I understand NFPA 14 Section 6.1.1 to have a requirement for supervision of the standpipe system:

6.1.1 Location of Dry Standpipes.
Dry standpipes shall be monitored in accordance with NFPA 72 with supervisory air pressure.

Are all dry manual standpipe systems provided with supervisory air? Or is this section meant to pertain only to automatic or semi-automatic dry systems?

I don't think holding supervisory air under pressure in a dry manual standpipe is feasible, being that there would be multiple points of leakage: www.aspe.org/pipeline/is-supervisory-air-monitoring-feasible-for-manual-dry-standpipes/

Just wondering if I'm completely missing the boat here, or if there's something about this portion of NFPA 14 that I'm misinterpreting. Thanks in advance.

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21 Comments

Alex

4/4/2022 06:55:00 am

Hi,

In Massachusetts, the current addition of NFPA 14, Standard for the Installation of Standpipe and Hose systems is the 2013 edition.

The code section you stated in your question is not complete. The complete section reads as follows: 6.1.1 Location of Dry Standpipes: Dry standpipes shall not be concealed unless the piping integrity is monitored with supervisory air pressure, in accordance with NFPA 72.

To me, this section reads that only automatic and semiautomatic dry systems are permitted to be concealed OR any other dry standpipe that is monitored with supervisory air pressure. I list automatic and semiautomatic because section 5.2.1.4 requires them to be monitored, where other forms of standpipes do not need to be.

Chapter 5 outlines the system requirements for standpipes. There is no section here that outlines that a manual dry system requires any maintenance of air pressure.

Lastly, for air pressure to be monitored, the system would require to be closed. Since values are not required on a manual dry standpipe (6.3.1.4), the system is at atmospheric pressure. In turn, there is no way to monitor the air pressure.

If you are currently on a project, and the owner/AHJ is requesting the system be monitored, I would explore other options or other types of standpipes with them.

Alex

Wes

4/4/2022 11:27:15 am

It looks like this isn't coming from the 2013 Edition. Section 5.2 of the 2013 Edition of NFPA 14 only addresses Automatic and Semi-Automatic Dry systems.

The section in question is 6.1.1 - which changed from the 2013 Edition of NFPA 14 to the 2016 Edition. Here's what it was:

2013 Edition:
6.1.1 Location of Dry Standpipes. Dry standpipes shall not be concealed unless the piping integrity is monitored with supervisory air pressure, in accordance with NFPA 72, National Fire Alarm and Signaling Code.

2016 Edition:
6.1.1 Location of Dry Standpipes. Dry standpipes shall be monitored in accordance with NFPA 72 with supervisory air pressure.

So, based upon this change for the 2016 Edition, the allowance of having a dry, manual, "exposed" system be at atmospheric air is no longer allowed. The 2019 Edition of NFPA 14 did not make any updates to this section.

4/4/2022 11:45:23 am

Great catch, Wes! Shows the importance of adding the year to any code section referenced.

4/4/2022 11:28:28 am

What I'm trying to say is - Alex looks to be correct, up until the verbiage was changed in NFPA 14 (Section 6.1.1) in the 2016 Edition.

Craig Hanson link

4/4/2022 08:13:17 am

I am glad you brought this up. I have spoken with the lead of the NFPA 14 committee on this myself and yes, it is required. There was a dry standpipe that when the FD charged it failed. As a result all must be supervises.

I do not personally agree with this. I think it should be a NFPA 25 issue not a NFPA 14 issue. I pose the question that this is adding cost where it is not needed. especially if it is a building that is subject to freezing . Now an alarm system is needed hat was not there before and unless the compressor is rated for freezing temperatures then possible a separate room to keep the compressor heated.

I am hoping in the next code revision cycle this can be addressed as it should be in the NFPA 25.

4/4/2022 08:37:57 am

I still disagree that it is required. When you call or post a question to NFPA, you are provided with the employees own interpretation of the code. I wonder if you would get a different response if posted again?

To me, it doesn't seem feasible or possible without modifications to the standpipe.

[Note: I believe the folks over at NFPA do a fantastic job and are a great resource. My comment above is in no way saying they are not helpful. I simply have had experiences where I reached out multiple times on the same issue and have received different answers]

Raymond Klein

4/4/2023 06:20:55 am

Please bring it up to him again. I deal with tunnels and this change is coasting hundreds of thousands of dollars per project and adding nothing to the safety of the system. Adding compressed air in remote locations requires power, communications, a structure to houses the air compressor, motorized valves before the air release/vacuum valve and maintenance personnel to check on the site regularly. It caused lots of false alarms sending the fire department t the site.
Secondly in a tunnel what happens if a HV is left open and water is applied for testing or an emergency? water spills out onto the road - no damage no problem.
There are other things than buildings that standpipes are required for and the way that this section has been reworded is so narrow that it is adversely effecting things and causing a lot more harm to the public without adding any benefit.
Making a change like this so that you do not have to check the HV prior to testing is disgracefully.

Jesse

4/4/2022 08:15:40 am

I agree with Alex. The provision for requiring supervisory air is in 2016 NFPA 14 5.2.1.4. The entirety of 5.2 deals with Automatic and Semi-Automatic standpipe systems.

Glenn Berger

4/4/2022 08:16:38 am

Take a look at the Report on Proposals for NFPA 14 for the current issue (maybe the previous version). There is a desire to ensure integrity of the system.

Craig Hanson

4/4/2022 08:24:13 am

I agree the system needs to have integrity. That is what regular inspections are for. I question how this requirement can be applied on docks or other structures that a compressor and supervisory alarm may not be reasonably installed without significant cost and modifications.

Brad K

4/4/2022 10:39:39 am

I agree with Craig. 5 year hydros are covered for this situation in NFPA 25. Adding Air then adds potential for condensation and freeze issues as well as corrosion. I would hope these concerns are eventually clarified in NFPA 14. Fortunately my area does not permit manual standpipes.

4/4/2022 10:15:18 am

14:6.1.1 Location of Dry Standpipes.

Dry standpipes shall be monitored in accordance with NFPA 72 with supervisory air pressure.

This is in the 2016 edition.

4/4/2022 10:29:51 am

3.3.17.1 Automatic Dry Standpipe System.
A standpipe system permanently attached to a water supply capable of supplying the system demand at all times, containing air or nitrogen under pressure, the release of which (as from opening a hose valve) opens a dry pipe valve to allow water to flow into the piping system and out of the opened hose valve.

3.3.17.4 Manual Dry Standpipe System.
A standpipe system with no permanently attached water supply that relies exclusively on the fire department connection to supply the system demand.

3.3.17.6 Semiautomatic Dry Standpipe System.
A standpipe system permanently attached to a water supply that is capable of supplying the system demand at all times arranged through the use of a device such as a deluge valve and that requires activation of a remote control device to provide water at hose connections.

5.2 only pertains to Automatic or Semiautomatic Dry Standpipe systems because they are similar Pre-action, Dry pipe, and Deluge sprinkler systems. They require additional action to deliver water and have additional components that make it a complete system. A dry pipe manual standpipe system has no water supply attached and no means of showing leakage. That is why I think the generic monitoring for air loss is in the installation chapter for dry pipe systems. Just my two cents.

4/4/2022 11:12:00 am

I would concur with DS above. NFPA 14is an installation standard and is a requirement for new systems not retroactive to existing systems. I have seen on more than one occasion where the periodic inspections don't and cannot verify the pipe integrity. The time to determine system integrity is NOT when the system is needed.

David Toshio Williams

4/4/2022 11:47:31 am

Just starting construction of the NavFac project with exterior exit stairs and manual dry standpipes. We are providing a nitrogen supervisory pressure system to meet the Navy's requirements.

robert bennett

4/6/2022 01:27:25 pm

The answer is multifocal and involves not only NFPA 14 but also NFPA 72.
NFPA 14 (19) states:

Chapter 6 Installation Requirements
6.1* Location and Protection of Piping.
6.1.1 Location of Dry Standpipes. Dry standpipes shall be
monitored in accordance with NFPA 72 with supervisory air
pressure.

The standard does not specify or limit the application of 6.1.1 to only one type of dry standpipe therefore it applies to all dry standpipes.
Section 5.2.1, 5.2.3, and 5.2.3 apply to the specific types of systems and provides NFPA 14 specifics for how to set up the air system.

Section 6.1.1 send us to NFPA 72 (19)
A word search in NFPA 72 for "air pressure" results in 6 instances where NFPA 72 refers to air monitoring. None of the references refer to standpipe systems specifically so we are limited to inferring the intent.

3.3.141.5 defines low air pressure as an off normal or supervisory signal
14.4.3.2 talks about acceptance testing and periodic testing
17.17.2.2.1 (C) talks about how to set the pressure switch for dry pipe sprinkler systems.
The remaining references are in the annex.

Because NFPA 14 specifically states that all dry system shall be monitored with air in accordance with NFPA 72 the inference is that the requirements from NFPA 72 Section 17.17.2.2.2 apply. This section simply requires low air monitoring and a supervisory signal when there is a 10 PSI change in pressure.

Conclusion:
NFPA 14 specifically requires air monitoring for all dry standpipes and NFPA 72 provides some insight on how to do it.

The need for air monitoring of dry standpipes is necessary even in non-freezing locations because freeze damage is not the only cause of standpipes being out of service when needed. Parking garage physical damage can go unnoticed for extended periods of time between hydrostatic or flow testing. Vandalism to valves and opening of remote valves can make a standpipe compromised when needed. Remote water flow or damage would have to be found and corrected in order to maintain a usable fire flow is other portions of the building.

I hope this helps explain the reason and need for air monitoring of all dry standpipes.

Jay

6/21/2022 05:48:12 pm

From the NFSA Tech Notes for May 2022:

Chapter 5 of the 2016 edition appears too ambiguous as to if it is a requirement to include supervisory air on a manual dry standpipe. Does NFPA 14 require supervisory air in manual dry standpipes?

No, the 2016 edition of NFPA 14, Standard for the Installation of Standpipe and Hose Systems, does not require supervisory air on manual dry standpipes. The requirements found in Chapter 5 are extracted from NFPA 13, Standard for the installation of Sprinklers, and are for dry valves installed on standpipe systems. These requirements have been very confusing for several cycles of the standard and the technical committee is looking to address this issue in the 2023 edition of NFPA 14.

NFPA 14 second draft is concluding this week with new requirements for supervisory air on all dry systems. This was a unanimous decision from the technical committee and if passes ballot, the next edition of NFPA 14 will require all manual dry standpipe to be supervised with air.

4/4/2023 06:30:24 am

Why monitor all? What about the 12' long standpipe that has the FDC at the base of the bridge and the HV at bridge level? Why would you require compressed air here? What purpose would is serve?
We are trying to add standpipes along all elevated roads - miles and miles of standpipe that will serve the public. Adding compressed air requirements will add millions of dollars to the project and kill them. Systems have to be filled in 10 min - adding compressed air then requires motorized valves before each air release valve. This requires electrical powered be run along the road to each of these. It also cuts the fill time considerably and shortens the max length of the system requiring more land be acquired, more pump rooms and more pints of failure. Again for what purpose and how does this benefit the public?
Would appreciate a response and reason other than the test company does not have to check the HV prior to testing.

RB Robert Bennett

4/4/2023 06:55:20 am

Raymond, It sounds like you are designing something other than an NFPA 14 standpipe. Let's look at NFPA 14 section 3.3.19 and 3.3.20. The definition of standpipe is a system of pipes that deliver water to vertical floor of a building or horizontally in a structure.
Admittedly a bridge or elevated highway is a structure, but it is not a building. Maybe the use of NFPA 14 is not appropriate for a custom designed alternate water supply system. You may want to employ a mechanical or fire protection engineer to custom design a water delivery system that meets your needs and incorporates the portions of NFPA 14 that are appertaining to your particular situation and needs.

Raymond Curtis Klein

4/4/2023 07:30:46 am

Road Tunnels and limited access highways are covered by NFPA 502. NFPA 502 requires compliance with NFPA 14. A tunnel has both horizontal and vertical aspects to it and while in the past Section 6.1 of NFPA 14 (prior to 2016) had sufficient verbiage to infer that when compressed air is used it shall comply with NFPA 72, which should be the only point of 6.1.1 (because other sections of cover whether compressed air is required or not), the current wording negates all other sections and simply requires all systems with that are dry to have compressed air.
Though I rarely design dry standpipes for buildings, how do you maintain UL listed systems under this new requirement? With Compressed air the air release valve requires a motorized valve before it so that the system maintains air pressure but there are no motorized valves listed for this purpose none of the new systems are UL listed.
I am very interested in this issue and would love the opportunity to talk about it to any of the NFPA 14 committee members.
Sincerely
Ray Klein PE, Fl, NY, CT

John McCormack

11/1/2023 01:36:26 pm

Ray have you gotten any further clarification of this? I am dealing with this issue currently on new bridge and tunnel standpipe projects.

Dry Manual Standpipes Require Supervisory Air?

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