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NFPA 25 states that a 3-year full flow test for a dry sprinkler system should show no significant delay in water delivery time from previous tests.
What is considered a significant delay? Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe
6 Comments
How would you classify metallic spray cans containing aerosol Category 3, where 20.1% of the contents by mass are flammable (specifically, propane-2-ol, isopropyl alcohol, or isopropanol). The product Flash point exceeds 61 (23 – 60) °C (estimated value).
How should I define and handle this product under NFPA 30B? Is it defined as Aerosol Level 3? Thank you! Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe Does a sprinkled tenant space Group M with an occupant load of 51 and sprinklers separated by fire-rated walls from the rest of the mall need automatic fire detection?
I think a pull station or the flow switch to active the notification would be enough. The existing plans show detection in the main sales area, in the electrical room and where the power supply for the NAC is located. According to my analysis the only mandatory detector should be the one in the power supply room. Wouldn't you agree? Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe How far should firewood be stored from a single-family home within city limits?
Is there an operable mandate for this within the fire code? Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe For a flammable liquid pump surface area calculation method, NFPA 15 Section 7.3.2 says to calculate a projected prism with 5 sides or a projected plane at the footprint of the pump.
Paragraph states "projected surface" but it is not defined in the code. What is the projected surface? How should we calculate or determine the projected surface? Thanks in advance. Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe I have never quite understood the difference between the maximum floor area per unit of A and the maximum floor area per extinguisher in NFPA 10 Table 6.2.1.1.
If you are only permitted 6,000 sqft for a 2A (3,000 x 2) how does the 11,250 sqft limitation come into play? Regardless, with a 75-ft travel distance maximum, you rarely get anywhere near these limits, but I wonder if anyone knows more. Thanks in advance! Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe Has anyone here ever done a green points calculation for the benefit of having a flow meter on a fire pump and rat racing back to suction rather than waste?
I’ve heard many talk of this and how conscious they are of our effort to save water, but I’m wondering if anyone has ever submitted applications, calculated savings, or presented evidence. I’d also be interested in local or regional purveyor requirements on waste, reclamation, and disposal, if there are any. Thanks in advance. Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe Can you use a different k-factor for sprinklers in a duct and plenum versus the k-factor for the booth sprinklers in a paint spray booth?
I was told I could not use different k-factors to calculate the hazard. Thanks in advance. Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe During a fire event, the pressure in a sprinkler system drops, and the jockey pump starts but cannot make up the pressure loss. Then, the electric fire pump kicks in.
Should the jockey still be running, or stop? Same for electric and diesel: should they operate together if the pressure still goes down and the electric pump cannot make the pressure up? Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe Tire Storage without Sprinklers Whenever the storage of tires is brought up, I often see people focusing on the area, volume, and storage height requirements that necessitate sprinklers.
Looking through IFC requirements to fully understand these triggering design factors, I found the Section “3206.10.1.2 Nonsprinklered Buildings: Aisles in nonsprinklered buildings shall be not less than 96 inches (2438 mm) wide.” Am I correct in understanding that this would require all aisles in between tire racks, as well as a clear walkway around tire rack to be at least 8’ wide? This is something I have never seen in an unsprinklered tire storage setting and would effectively require sprinklers for any efficient for of rack tire storage. Am I understanding this section correctly or am I missing something? Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe We have a mass timber building. It's Type III-A construction with an NFPA 13 system.
The building has a large exterior roof canopy (more than 4-ft wide) primarily used as a pedestrian walkway and building entrance. For these types of roof projections, overhangs, canopies, etc., IBC Section 705.2.3 allows the following options:
However, in the NFPA 13 standard (Section 9.2.3), it seems to only allow the following options for omitting sprinklers from these locations:
These two codes seem to be at odds with each other and it’s not clear to me which one governs. The IBC clearly allows the use of a 1-hr rating or heavy timber, both of which would allow this particular project to omit sprinklers from the exterior roof canopy. However, NFPA 13 seems to require the use of sprinklers at these locations. Does the IBC allowance overrule NFPA 13 here? Or does NFPA 13's requirements overrule the IBC? What's the code basis that would support priority of one or the other? Appreciate any insight or how you've seen these situations handled on other projects. Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe I'm designing a dry system feeding an area of about 600 sqft. It's a Light Hazard area, so the design criteria is just 0.10 gpm/sqft over 1,500 sqft.
Should the design area include the entire area, or could I just calculate the 5 most demanding sprinklers? Per NFPA 13 2016, Section 11.2.3.2.3.2 under the quick response sprinkler section states, "The number of sprinklers in the design area shall never be less than five." The section above that does state that the area of operation can be reduced, but that only applies to a wet pipe system, amongst a few other points. Of course, this is a dry system, so I don't believe the reduction can be used for this situation. How should this design area be calculated? Thanks in advance. Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe Is there any particular drainage pipe requirements needed for an FDC that makes a U-loop underground?
Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe I have a project using ESFR under NFPA 13-2022 Edition.
Section 14.2.11.3.4 states that an obstruction will not be combined if the distance to the adjacent obstacle is greater than three times the width of the adjacent obstruction. The appendix states the minimum distance to another obstacle as three times the diameter of the pipe. For example, I am analyzing a 1 foot wide vent duct and a 2-inch pipe. Should they be 3 feet apart, or 6 inches apart, in order to consider each item it's own obstruction? Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe I'm trying to understand how (if) Section 7.2.3.8 of NFPA 13, 2016 Edition could be applied.
Dry pipe systems with water delivery times other than 7.2.3.2, 7.2.3.5, and 7.2.3.7 shall be acceptable where listed by a nationally recognized testing laboratory. When would this come into play? Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe Are stand-alone clean agent systems required to be monitored by a supervising station or constantly attended location?
I am reviewing plans for a small, remote equipment shed that is equipped with a clean agent suppression system. The building is remote enough and small enough that IBC wouldn't require a fire alarm or sprinkler system. The designer claims that it doesn't have to report out, but I think they're wrong. I think this would fall under the IBC 907.3 requirements for a dedicated function panel, which still requires supervision of the detectors at a "constantly attended location." Since the building isn't constantly attended, it would have to dial out to the central receiving station, not just to some guy's email. From what I've gathered, a full-blown FACP wouldn't be required, but a dedicated panel to dial out would be. What is your take on this? Thanks in advance. Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe Suppose you have a small enough elevator lobby with hold-open doors.
Could you use one detector to activate both recall and door closing, so long as you comply with the spacing requirements for both the doors (based on ceilings) and distance to the elevator(s)? I don't see why you couldn't if you have an intelligent system that could achieve this through programming, and I don't see anything in NFPA 72 that would prohibit this either. Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe Is a library vault filled with Class A banker boxes filled with paper on multiple shelves considered a deep seated fire hazard?
Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe To comply with NFPA-20, the fire pump suction must have at least 10 pipe diameters from the pump flange to the elbow or tee. According to Section 4.16.6.3, the pipe can be horizontal or vertical.
Does the vertical pipe have to be at a 90-degree angle, or will a 45-degree angle be acceptable because that's the only way it can be installed? Thanks in advance. Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe Thank you to our top contributors for rounding out the unofficial end of summer! We can't thank you enough for the great discussions. Here are our top contributors for August:
We're designing a small footprint high rise with 2 stairs/standpipes, and 3" drains in the stairs for floor control valve drains and testing/verifying hose valves.
Primary water is supplied from a vertical turbine pump and tank. Local codes don’t allow direct outdoor drains so it’s either into the tank or into large hub drains. Owner is very ‘green’ and looking for ways to reduce water usage. We’ve already got the fire pump test flows back into the tank. We’re considering flowing the stair’s drains into a hub with a bypass into the tank -- hub for system draining, tank for PRV and flow switch testing. Is it advisable or preferable to run these stair drains back into the tank? Concerns include flowing black, stinky water into the tank and possibly adding pipe scale into the tank Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe Can a fitting (a 90-degree elbow) from a fire ductile iron water line be under the footing, which turns the pipe up into the Fire Pump room?
In other words, the pipe feed comes from a water tank underground, then turns up with a 90 under the building footing and the pipes through the footing. Is this acceptable? Sent in anonymously for discussion. Click Title to View | Submit Your Question | Subscribe |
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